Hey all you beautiful selfhosters,
What are your suggestions for frugally obtaining HDDs in the current economic climate? Specifically the EU (Netherlands).
I’m looking at second hand drives, but even those go for €100+ now, with bad sectors and all.
Can we organise a collective AI datacenter robbery and doll out some stolen drives? 😁
Ebay, particularly GoHardDrives, or sometimes you’ll find new drives from random sellers.
I also check ServerPartDeals. Drives are pricy these days, don’t sneeze near your NAS.
Edit: I’m not sure if they ship internationally or not, however.
I still have some IOMEGA Zip drives. LOL Man, I remember when those seemed inexhaustible.
You know the fun part is you could just about use a 750 zip disk to steam video. Read speeds are about 7.5mb/s…enough for 1-2 simultaneous 480p Jellyfin streams.
Shit…everybody about RAID and here we are suggesting RAIT. No school like old school.
I still think the “DVD shuffler clockwork JF server with AI upscale” idea would be more fun to build tho, because as stupid as it sounds, the maths adds up. It would be gloriously cursed, but 3000+ hours of video is 3000 + hours of video.
Marty, we need to go back…to the future!
(Mind you, those top out at 320GB per cartridge)
Kidding aside, for deep storage…?
LTO-8 is 12TB native per cartridge. A used LTO can be as little as $300 USD with a 12TB cart $65ish. Ancient LTO-3 can be had for like…$5…and stores upto 800GB per tape.
So…if it’s deep storage you want…that’s one insane option.
OTOH if you’re looking for a Jellyfin streamer…they’re tape, so random access would suck bad. You’d genuinely be better off optical media at that point lol
Though if we’re time travelling… DVD shufflers (400+ DVDs) were a thing for a minute. You’d have to write bridge software because they’re HDMI and com port only…hmm. Checking quickly, they seem to go for $100 USD…is this even possible…? You’d be limited to 1 stream at a time, but I can see a way to share that across multiple TVs with HDMI splitter…hmm…how do I carry RF remote signal from each room back to main unit…oh, I don’t need to, could I make a web ui that controls the shuffler via a Pi to RS-232, that you access on your phone?..Shit…i could do this.
$300…I could do this. I could make a clock work Jellyfin server…
No, stop. This is a dangerous rabbit hole.
PS: shit - I just thought of two better options - and one of them is even semi sane (store video at 480-540p on DVD as mkv, use Nvidia shield to upscale on fly to 1080p). Back of envelope maths suggests this would be around 3000 movies.
I should not be online this late at night with easy access to credit card.
Everyone asks “where do we get more storage?” and not “do we need to hoard all of this?”
People treat deleting like some dirty word, but all good collections need to be organized and pruned.
You don’t even necessarily need to delete either. If you have a ton of H.264 video you could convert it to 265 or AV1 with minimal quality loss, but huge space savings.
The answer is yes.
Because the answer to the second question is a very clear “yes”.
With how the internet is going, I don’t think we will be able to get content from it in 5 to 10 years. It will be completely locked down, so all we have on our drives will be it. Back to mailing DVDs!
Yes. If I want to organize and dedupe what I have then I need enough storage to work on it, a lot of my storage is spinning rust 7-15 years old, and if I have the space I’m going to use it. I have family photos and a music library going back to 2005. Too many things like old games need custom fixes installed to work correctly on modern hardware, and the internet isn’t as permanent as it was cracked up to be.
There’s plenty of reasons to hold on to older data.
I have family photos starting in 2001, scanned/captured photos and video going back 50 years, music, and backups of all my Xbox DVDs (WTF is the original Xbox even called today?). But that’s a few terrabytes. It can all fit on a few USB sticks. (Which I do as a third level backup.)
The real space killers are the TV shows and movies that I will watch at most once every 20 years. I could delete almost all of it. But I don’t. Instead I keep looking for bigger storage options.
I’ve become much more selective with my video quality. I’ve found that 480p encoded from a raw source produces pretty acceptable quality, anything that isn’t made to be eye candy I’ll encode myself from a raw file down to 480p. There have been many things that have been very hard to find, so I feel it’s more important that they exist, rather than be in the highest definition possible. Quality of pixels is more important that quantity of pixels.
This really depends on what you’re watching it on. 480p can look fine on a phone but like garbage on a 65" OLED. I find that 720p is good for most shows that aren’t visually stunning (like Foundation) while most movies look fine in 1080p on the aforementioned OLED.
Aren’t old games pretty small though? It’s new ones that you may need a huge volume to store many of them. Depends how much we are talking of course. 2TB or 50TB?
Depends what era but generally yes. Xbox 360 seem to be in the 3-6GB range, Wii / GameCube in the 1-2GB range. Older gens are ofc smaller.
My entire gaming library is approx 200gb, but it’s curated, retro / indy focused (early 2000s to mid 2010’s)
- Beyond Sunset
- Citizen Sleeper
- Dino Strike (Wii)
- Divinity: Original Sin – Enhanced Edition
- Donut County
- Exo One
- Fallout 3
- Final Fantasy X (PS2)
- Firewatch
- Flower
- Go Vacation (Wii)
- Gun
- I Am Your Beast
- Inscryption
- Just Cause 2
- Killer Frequency
- LEGO Harry Potter: Years 1–4 (Wii)
- Lifeless Planet
- Luigi’s Mansion (GC)
- Mario Kart: Double Dash!! (GC)
- Mini Ninjas (Wii)
- New Super Mario Bros (Wii)
- Luanti
- Scanner Somber
- Shadow of the Colossus (PS2)
- A Short Hike
- Sid Meier’s Pirates! (Wii)
- Stanley Parable: Ultra Deluxe
- State of Mind
- Super Mario Sunshine (GC)
- SUPERHOT
- The Exit 8
- The House of the Dead: Overkill (Wii)
- The Incredible Hulk: Ultimate Destruction (GC)
- TOEM
- Twelve Minutes
- The Invincible
- Untitled Goose Game
- UnMetal
- Diablo 2
- WarioWare: Smooth Moves (Wii)
- We Love Katamari (PS2)
- Prince of Persia (Wii)
- Hitman 2 (GC)
- Cubivore (Wii)
TIL Sid Meier’s Pirates was released on Wii.
Its a really good version too. My favourite is probably the OG C64 (first love and all that) but the Wii has some real hidden gems.
The answer is 42.
yes
We wouldn’t be here if we hadn’t already answered the second question affirmatively.
Depends on the size you are looking for, but I saw some good deals for ~4TB on Vinted
Frugally (legally) obtained HDDs are still going to cost you a lot of money, there is no way around that at the moment. If you need it, pay up and be done with it. If you just kind of want it, start sorting through your piles of data you don’t actually need (yes, you have that, stop lying to yourself) to free up space for things you do actually need.
So is there a raid 12 for my 13 500GB drives?
RAIDz2 for 5.5TB with 2-disk redundancy.
All of a sudden USB becomes important. 😅
True, but it’ll be nice to have enough space to let the future arr stack I plan on spinning up, roam free
In my country we have a website that resells “old” and used server hardware, including HDDs for reasonable prices. Although that has gone up a lot over the last year or so.
Maybe you have something like that in the Netherlands? I recently bought an 18TB drive for around €400.
Storage is just expensive these days. Just like RAM.
Get lucky - just as this was starting I saw a failed disk notification on my NAS so I ordered a new drive just before they went up. Then I realized it was a stale notification for the drive I replaced a year ago so I have a spare should one fail.
Honestly, I’ve been taking a chance on eBay. If the price is close to $10/TB and the drive is an enterprise drive that is listed as known to be working, with a good return policy, I take the risk. I just run tests as soon as I have it so far, all have been good (eight purchases).
Same. I use these drives in a mirrored setup or to hold data that’s replaceable. If they make it a few months without showing errors they might get entrusted to something more important. I’ll shell out for a new drive for my constantly in use drives, luckily I read the warning signs and bought a few 20tb HDDs when ram and SSDs started skyrocketing. I’m kicking myself for not grabbing a few backup m.2 nvme and 2.5" SSDs, because I’m already doing the hardrive shuffle in my mini PCs. I’m fine living life with networked rusty spinners, but I really really don’t want to go back to spinny boot/high throughput drives.
I usually scavenge old drives from work. On one hand they’re a bit smaller than I’d like them to be, but on the other hand they’re free except from the minor work and documentation involved in ensuring that no company related data remain.
Wish my company allowed that. Everything goes to a licensed secure destruction service that literally puts them through an industrial shredder. Awesome to watch, but wasteful as all hell.
Well, there’s a footnote on my end: Me taking the drives home is a bit of a grey area, as the procedures say that the drives are to be mechanically destroyed when no longer needed. It doesn’t specify needed by whom. And I do attack them with my angle grinder, so it’s in accordance with company policy.
And yes, my employer knows and is OK with it. We go through a ridiculous amount of drives due to large storage needs, so pragmatism tends to trump bureaucracy.
Also true for me
Personally I just track sales constantly. I know I don’t want less than my smallest, so I look for 14TB and up. If I come.across an upgrade for the right price, I buy it even if I don’t need it right now. The drive I replace moves to another array, so its not wasted. Hell I’m still using some 2-3TB drives in the (much larger in qty) backup array.
The only thing I’d point out with the DC is they may not even have the hardware in there - there’s a stupid amount of money that is being counted against product not even installed (or even shipped yet) in the stock value game these narcissistic scumbags are playing.
Serverpartdeals?
€356 excluding USA to EU shipping… Oof!
This is where I go. It’s ridiculously expensive right now, though. I just paid nearly 2k USD for three large capacity drives for our local UnRaid box.
Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I’ve seen in this thread:
Fewer Letters More Letters NAS Network-Attached Storage RAID Redundant Array of Independent Disks for mass storage SATA Serial AT Attachment interface for mass storage SSD Solid State Drive mass storage
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I’ve had good success buying second hand on eBay, but I bet you could also do worse than getting used parts off Gumtree, look for anyone selling a broken or outdated computer - or in the free section - and spend some time going through a pile of ewaste, shucking all the drives, and then running tests on them.
Do you happen to live in zuid holland?
I have 2 unopened Seagate IronWolf ST4000VN006 that I’ll be happy selling.
No idea what a fair price or your budget would be. That is if you are interested in these drives to begin with.
